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Building a Whiskey still

by densad on March 30, 2008

Table of Contents

License: Attribution Non-commercial Share Alike (by-nc-sa) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2

Intro: Building a Whiskey still . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2

step 1: The Process . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2

step 2: Making your own still . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3

step 3: Braga!!! . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3

step 4: Distilling . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3

step 5: filtration . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4

step 6: testing . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4

step 7: The End . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5

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http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
License: Attribution Non-commercial Share Alike (by-nc-sa)

Intro: Building a Whiskey still

I will be explaining how to "theoretically" make a distiller (Whiskey Still). (this Instructable is for learning purposes only as I am not sure of your local laws. i take
no resposibility for your actions!)

The still shown below was given to my grandfather as a gift, but it is a fully working still which would theoretical create distilled water, alcohol, etc (we never really tested
it). It may not be homemade, but it is perfect for explaining the basic process.

Please remember to vote if you like my Instructable.

Image Notes Image Notes

1. container for the fermented mash 1. refrigerater (pour cold water into here)
2. thermomiter 2. random funnel
3. burner 3. cup
4. Condensation tube.
5. Decerative copper backboard

step 1: The Process

First, i will explain the process of getting alcohol.
To start you need a "Fermented Mash"- "Braga" (recepies will be at the end). The braga is what originally contains the alcohol.

Once you have the braga, you will place it into into the container which is heated. The braga will boil, causeing the alcohol (which has a lower boiling point than water) to
evaporate, go up the tube, and into the "Zmeevik" (curly tube in the refrigerator, aka the condensator). In the zmeevik, the alcohol condensates (do to the lower
temperature caused by cold water in the refrigerator) and drips into the cup (or bucket if your makeing a lot).
Make sure the thermomiter never goes above 90 degrees(centigrade) (at 100 degrees (centigrade) water starts to boil; if this happens, it means there is no more alcohol
in the braga).

You can now through the alcohol-less braga away.

Congradulastions! You have made your first "Samogon" (which means self distilled or moonshine).

Image Notes Image Notes

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 1. refrigerater (pour cold water into here) 1. container for the fermented mash
2. random funnel 2. thermomiter
3. cup 3. burner
4. Condensation tube.
5. Decerative copper backboard

step 2: Making your own still

You will need:
1)a kettle (the kind you put on the stove to heat)
2)a copper tube (a few yards)
3)a bucket
4)a bottle
5)a thermometer
6)a drill
7)a drill bit with the same diameter as the thermometer

First, you need drill a hole in the lid of the kettle. Into the hole, insert the thermometer and glue in place with a thermally resistant glue, making sure that the glue forms an
air-tight seal around the hole.
Now you have to make your zmeevik. Take the copper tube, find a larger round object, like a fire extinguisher, and wind the tube around the round object. Remember to
put sand in the tube so that it doesn't bend flat. Leave a length of tube at the beginning and end of the tube (end A & end B). It should be a spiral.
Drill a hole with the same diameter as the tube near the bottom of bucket.

step 3: Braga!!!
This is probably the most important part of your samogon. Without it you cannot make your moonshine.

This part is relatively easy. The recipes!:

1*)600 gramms sugar, 20 gramms yeast, 3 litters water: mix everything together & set in a warm place for a week.
2)600 g. syrup, 20 g. yeast, 3 litters water: see (1)
3)a can of tomato paste, bottle of beer, 1 kilogramm of sugar, 3 litters of water: mix ingreidients, let sit in a warm place for 4-5 days.

To make whiskey you need a braga made from mashed up barley (the process is much the same).

I used this one

step 4: Distilling
Put the prepared kettle onto the stove (or hot plate). insert end A of the zmeevik into the kettle spout and seal it. (to seal holes, use a "dough" of water and flour, (not too
wet) and smear it over the holes, then wait for it to dry.) Pour your braga into the kettle and seal the lid onto the kettle. Put end B of the zmeevik through the hole in the
bucket, seal the hole, and fill the bucket with cold water. The bucket should be on a stool or table or something so that the zmeevik isn't strained. Put the bottle you
prepared earlier under the opening of end B, to collect the spirit that will flow from your still.

Make sure everything is air-tight.

Now you can light the stove (turn on the hot plate), so that the braga starts boiling.

Make sure that the thermometer never goes up to 100 degrees centigrade. At 100 degrees centigrade water startes boiling and instead of booze you get water vapors.

The first 100 ml of ever liter and last 300 ml of ever liter of your samogon should be thrown away (poured down the drain) because the contain harmful chemicals.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 Image Notes
1. BRAGA!
2. Alcohol
3. Refrigerator
4. Funel

Image Notes
1. BOOZE!!

step 5: filtration
When your pure-ish alcohol from your braga has been distilled the first time, you have to filter it.

Take natural wood charcoal (without lighter fluid), grind it into a powder, and place it into a bottle with you samogon. Close the lid and start shaking the bottle. when
afterwards take a clothe or bangage and filter the concotion ( this is just to keep your still clean) and pour it back into the kettle. Repeat the distilation process.

For really pure alcohol you ned to do the distilation and filtration process 3-4 times.

step 6: testing
To test the purity of your alcohol you need Potassium Permanganate (KMnO4).

Take a little of your alcohol, put it in a seperat glass, pour in a tiny bit of KMnO4. If the Alcohol turns pink/purple it is "unclean" and should be distilled & filterd again. if the
alcohol becomes slightly pink or stays clear, it is safe to drink.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 Image Notes Image Notes
1. Very good pure alcohol 1. unclean crap that should be filtered and distilled again. DRINK THIS AND GO
BLIND!!! or die

step 7: The End

Congratulations! You have learned how to make a still and how to use it.

Remember, you have to dilute the alcohol so that only 40% of your drink is alcohol (you about 100% alcohol from your still). Mendeleev, (the guy who made the periodic
table of elements) researched vodka, and discovered that 40% alcohol is the best proportion.

P.S.: to make whiskey you need to use barley braga and keep the resulting alcohol (diluted to 40% alcohol) in an oak barrel for at least 3 years. (I'm not sure, but I think
the filtration method is the same).

P.S.S.: Remember, THIS IS REAL ALCOHOL! the laws of your country, state, etc. apply.
Alcohol is not recommended for children younger than 18, pregnant women. Do not drink alcohol and operate heavy machinery. Read a vodka label for the full message.

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Comments
50 comments Add Comment view all 64 comments

Lee Wilkerson says: Jul 19, 2010. 11:45 AM REPLY

Actually if you use at least 51% corn to make the sour mash and age the resulting alcohol solution at least 3 years in a new charred oak barrel, it qualifies as
bourbon. More aging results in a much smoother bourbon, but also loses more liquid to absorption/evaporation. A 25 year-old bourbon usually loses about
75% to 85%. ~/Lee

Eirinn says: May 28, 2010. 5:22 AM REPLY

I'm not big on chemistry, but i know ethanol is good and methanol is the stuff that makes you go blind (or worse) in the fermentation process and the
distillation - what prevents the reactions that produces methanol? What is the risk? And is this a cause of concern?

I'm guessing the permanganate triggers on methanol?

icharted says: Jul 5, 2009. 1:13 AM REPLY

What kind of syrup?

jimmy4352gmail.com says: Apr 17, 2010. 9:34 PM REPLY

Molasses makes Rum, blue agave (sold as a maple syrup substitute) will make tequila. Anything sugary will work; maple syrup, cane sugar, beet sugar,
even maple syrup. I imagine Caro syrup would be very effective because i think it's almost pure high fructose corn syrup (fructose is just a type of sugar).

osgeld says: May 7, 2008. 4:22 PM REPLY

altho the making of the "mash" was informative why did you title this "build a still" spent less than a paragraph on it?

jimmy4352gmail.com says: Apr 17, 2010. 9:29 PM REPLY

Actually the still used in this Instructable is sold for making perfume, but a still is a still, it can distill pretty much anything.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 densad says: May 9, 2008. 2:28 AM REPLY
'cause making a still is easy

osgeld says: May 10, 2008. 1:59 PM

(removed by author or community request)

unconcerned says: Oct 21, 2008. 7:44 PM REPLY

Stills are easy to make but I understand your confusion. There are 3 important parts to making a standard pot still (like the one in this DIY). First
you need a boiling pot, needs to be over 5 gallons otherwise you'll lose too much when you throw away your first and last 100ml (also called
heads and tails). Moving on your boiling pot needs to be connected to a condenser, you can either build your own (look it up, it would take too
much space to describe) or buy one (they are not cheap). At the end you need a collection pot/jar, this whole assembly will work better if its close
to air tight. That is a basic pot still that will produce a distillate of about 60% alcohol. For higher percentages you need a reflux still which is mildly
more complicated. And if you live in the U.S. for the love of god don't make one, no matter how young or poor you are its not worth the serious
prison time. And if you are under 21 don't be stupid, working a still is a very time consuming (takes over a week to produce even the foulest sugar
vodka) thing and your parents will catch on. If your over 21 spend the extra $5 a bottle and buy your vodka legally.

H3xx says: Sep 3, 2009. 7:23 PM REPLY

Depending on where in the states you live, it may be legal to make a small still for personal use, but don't just assume it's legal where you
are. Research it. Go to the court house and use their library. Its free to the public. Most places will require you to get special permits or just
flat out ban the still all together. Of course any where in the states you have to be over 21 one to even consider this. Personally I'd go with
beer first, as its easier to make, then try making a bottle of whiskey. This is more of a hobby than an enabler for alcoholics. Its easier and
some times cheaper to just go to the liquor store.

Esmagamus says: Aug 5, 2008. 2:34 PM REPLY

I want to build a car like that!

Alpha Bravo says: Apr 6, 2010. 12:13 AM REPLY

Excelent! at least someone is looking out for people's health! haven't seen this in any of the other instructables id is definitely something to consider if one
was to consider risking drinking this stuff.

Dr Watson says: Jan 30, 2010. 8:38 AM REPLY

found this if anyones interrested in get one instead of building one.
http://www.coolest-gadgets.com/20090309/the-missisipi-distiller/

smatt444 says: Sep 4, 2009. 9:06 PM REPLY

where does the thermometer have to be in the liquid or the steam?

Romi Sharpe says: Sep 17, 2008. 5:06 PM REPLY

I drink water from my tap which is brought to me through copper tubing. Should I be concerned?

H3xx says: Sep 3, 2009. 7:33 PM REPLY

Doing ANYTHING aside from breathing mountain air can get you sick in some form or fashion. you would have to have a lot of copper residue in your
drinking water to be seriously affected in any way. Try getting a faucet mount purifier if your really worried about it. Or better yet, make a purifier and
make an instructable an post it up here!

clovisfiesta says: Aug 26, 2009. 11:38 AM REPLY

Ok, densad. Congrats! Thank you.

lil jon168 says: May 24, 2009. 4:24 PM REPLY

i used 1 gallon of water 12 ounces and 2 packets of yeast (14 oz)

christopherk239 says: Aug 16, 2009. 1:54 PM REPLY

u can use 1kg of sugar 18.5g of yeast nd 2L of water 2 make the "braga" leave it in a container with an airlock on top for 5 days in a warm room

ragman3 says: Nov 20, 2008. 5:49 PM REPLY

where do i get some of this chemical?

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 icharted says: Jul 5, 2009. 1:17 AM REPLY
Skylighter.com

guy90 says: Feb 11, 2009. 7:01 PM REPLY

Very good instructable, well written and informative. thank you for the instructable ; )

I_am_Canadian says: Feb 7, 2009. 8:40 PM REPLY

Cool! I may try this. Great instructable!

mattyb_quick says: Jan 17, 2009. 3:25 AM REPLY

I might do 'how to buy a bottle of whisky from the shop'

glitch45 says: Nov 1, 2008. 6:14 PM REPLY

Sorry I came on this after the fact but after reading some of these comments I have to say something! Personally I think they should give an I.Q. test before
you can get Internet service.densad did an excellent job in giving a safe a simple direct approach on how to build a still. He is sharing his information people!!
He is providing a direct approach model. If he were to cover everything it would be called a book. If anyone was to attempt what he is saying without further
study he is an idiot. So in short, thank you dansad for sharing. Also you were very safety minded when you stated your parameters. A very good
Instructable!!

littlechef37 says: May 12, 2008. 2:48 PM REPLY

Did you actually make the still or did you buy it ?If you bought it where cuz I want one. Personally I use alcohol as a fuel in my pop can stoves when I am
hiking. But until now I had to buy ethanol because I had no way to distill it.

Dr. Rex says: Aug 27, 2008. 6:29 AM REPLY

For combustion purposes, like in a Trangia or other alcohol fueled stove, It would be a waste of time and money to destill alcohol for that. In most
countries you can buy denaturated alcohol almost everywhere, this is mainly used for cleaning and sterilisation, costs about 3.50$ / 2£ for 1 litre / 2 pints
/ a quarter gallon in most grocerie stores. In Scandinavia, that is. This works perfectly in alcohol based stoves. But i do understand why you want one, it
would be delightful to make ones own spirits/moonshine.

unconcerned says: Oct 21, 2008. 7:27 PM REPLY

You are absolutely correct you can by denatured alcohol at your local grocery store. But, in the U.S., you can only buy (depending on your state) up
to 95% alcohol. To use it as a fuel additive in motor vehicles it needs to be over 98% or you get too much water contamination in your gas. Also you
can get a license from the TTB so you can legally produce fuel alcohol in the U.S. http://www.ttb.gov/industrial/index.shtml

This can save you a ton of money at the gas tank!

densad says: May 21, 2008. 1:52 AM REPLY

It was a gift for my grandfather. It's made in france (i think)by Destil&co

iamdenteddisk says: Sep 25, 2008. 5:58 AM REPLY

Moonshine makeing is a family tradition for me, I remember my dad,uncles and grand father"pappy" makeing/delivering. My folks never where pursued by
thew law I'm guessing because of southern hospitality/backscratching, but I was about 4yrs old the first time I ever participated and learned alot about it
early. The poisoning was atributed to lead because of acid lead leaches out of soft copper which is most commonly found today hard copper had to be
hammered and rolled repeatedly heated. todays copper is just not the same stuff. If you build a still use hard copper, you will know it because "it will break
before it reaches a 90deg bend" and corners have to be heat fused or rolled. That is why you see them round stills with rolled seams or hammer rivots not
poprivots. The worm"curly tube" is made from hard copper tubeing by sawing down a sappling about 6-8 inches in diameter and leaveing it's stump about 4-
5 feet tall from the ground. It takes 3 men 1 on each end of the tube and 1 at the stump with a torch the tube is slowly heated and wraped around the tree like
a spring, leaveing 3 feet to work with on each end. The thump is just an "cooled air lock" to releave pressure/seperate the good from bad. simple theory is
hot boiler,worm,cold thump,-thump is up hill from boiler. The simple recipe is 8gallons fresh or distilled water no chlorine water, 12 pnds crack corn,4 pnds
white suger, 8oz malt or "4oz maltose extract".give it 21 days to ferment in stainles or glass container once you get a blue bubble strain,drain,squeeze pour it
in the boiler low heat "coals only". Test for "acid", first cup out toss it, second test it with the tip of your finger if it stings toss it, 3rd the same if it dont sting, try
tip of your tongue if it dont sting your makeing whisky. Keep runnin till your boiler temp is 100deg or you see the revenuers comeing, run a hundred yards
and shoot the botom of your thump go on home boy's. that will burn for days... Have fun with pappy's corn squeezins. Try not to shoot your brother, beat
your wife or drive and you will be ok tommarow I promise.

edugeek says: Sep 5, 2008. 8:55 AM REPLY

Question: Since Aluminum & now they have found COPPER are suspects in Alzheimers has anyone tested to see how much copper residue one would be
drinking from distilled products? Wouldn't it be better to build a still out of stainless?

densad says: Sep 18, 2008. 10:54 AM REPLY

sure, but stainless is more expensive and harder to properly shape

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 martynbiker says: Sep 5, 2008. 10:59 PM REPLY
to all the people who keep going on about COPPER in stills, please remember that Whisky has been distilled in Scotland for many hundreds of years using
stills made of copper. the only health warnings prob's come when you over indulge in Alcohol. The finished product doesn't contain any copper that would be
harmfull to health.

deth2all says: May 8, 2008. 9:15 PM REPLY

chances are about going blind are slim to none these days, its really an urban legend coming from prohibition days when people would use methanol and
isopropyl alcohol and god knows what else.

Esmagamus says: Aug 5, 2008. 2:38 PM REPLY

The problem with moonshine was the fact that the condensers were usually used car radiators that used anti freeze containing methanol. Even today,
anti freeze is generally poisonous, but not due to methanol.

DeLorean4905 says: May 9, 2008. 7:28 AM REPLY

I second that. There is NOTHING in ethanol that can make you go blind. That is caused by methanol, which does not occur in a saccharomyces-
fermented (yeast) brew. And the distilled product is never 100% alcohol. Since the boiling temp of ethanol and water are so close, you're still picking up a
lot of water in the vapors. The best you can get in one distilling is gonna be about 95% and that's pushing it.

jasontimmer says: Sep 6, 2008. 12:14 AM REPLY

BUT- ethanol is still poisonous. And fun.

densad says: May 10, 2008. 6:58 AM REPLY

I know the going blind thing was meant more as a joke than anything else

Gilo says: Jan 15, 2009. 5:18 PM REPLY

I just had a shot of vodka. "Ican't see! I can't see! I can't see!" Why? I close m eyes when I gulp it down in one swing. :) Good instructable!

Esmagamus says: Aug 5, 2008. 2:36 PM REPLY

Except if you use wine instead. Then, there's methanol.

wasty says: May 8, 2008. 8:01 PM REPLY

i hope i can make fuel grade ethanol and stick it to those __________ ________________ _____________ _____________ ________________
____________ oil companies

DeLorean4905 says: May 9, 2008. 7:28 AM REPLY

it's not fuel-grade unless it's as close to 100% pure as possible. Everclear is 190 proof (95%), and it won't run an engine very well. You have to "dry" the
water out by filtration. The easiest way is to get a molecular sieve, usually a certain type of zeolite. The pores in the matiral are big enough for H2O to
slide through, but C2H6O (ethanol) can't fit inside the mineral or pass through it. It still takes many passes (10 - 20) to get a purity of 199 - 200 proof,
which is needed for fuel-grade ethanol.

ogorir says: May 11, 2008. 2:35 AM REPLY

not exactly. you can run a 2 stroke on vodka, that I know from experience. also, the maximum purity of ethanol in standard atmosphere (1ATM, 20C)
is 96% and change. if you do remove more water than that, the alcohol will absorb water from the air until it equalizes around 96%. and additionally,
'fuel grade' ethanol is currently 70-85% ethanol with the remaining percent made up of various additives (mainly other hyrdocarbons).

Esmagamus says: Aug 5, 2008. 2:33 PM REPLY

You know, 60% of vodka is water. You better check if your engine isn't rusted.

DeLorean4905 says: May 13, 2008. 3:37 PM REPLY

the 70-85% you're referring to is the E85 blend, which is not "fuel grade ethanol", it is an ethanol-based fuel. "Fuel grade ethanol" IS 199-200
proof, but is not used solely in a gasoline engine. Like you said, it is diluted with hydrocarbons, but not water like in vodka. Fuel for a common
gasoline engine needs to have less than 5% water in it to run well. Water sinks in alcohol, and if the fuel falls out of emulsion, the fuel pump may
draw in mostly water for a short period, causing the engine to stutter. When you put vodka in your engine, did you make sure that there was
absolutely no gasoline left in there? and is the engine designed to run on an alcohol-based engine? Straight ethanol already provides very little
power in a gasoline engine, partly due to it's slower burn rate. There are several problems with vodka neat as a fuel: water makes up 60% of it - a
lot of the heat energy from the ethanol's combustion is absorbed to evaporate the water. water has a much high surface tension than ethanol - it
does not atomize as well, thus hindering the fuel from atomizing properly inside the chamber, and reducing the turbulence needed to provide a
good fuel/air mixture inside the combustion chamber. Also, you can very easily keep ethanol pure- just keep the cap on the container. The
heightened pressure inside the container once the liquid/gas mixture has reached the ideal state is a fraction of what a coke bottle contains
before you even shake it up.

http://www.instructables.com/id/Building-a-Whiskey-still/
 ogorir says: May 14, 2008. 9:16 AM REPLY
you're correct, vodka doesn't burn well in gas engine, but it will work in a pinch in some engines. but, regarding fuel grade ethanol, the
maximum concentration of pure ethanol in an open atmosphere is, as i said, like 96%. you need additives to prevent it from absorbing
moisture from the air at higher concentrations (like benzene*) *the benzene is actually left over from the industrial distillation process, but it
also keeps the almost 100% alcohol from reabsorbing water.

Konnrade says: Jun 6, 2008. 5:41 AM REPLY

Erm, to quote a tip from most laboratory safety standards...

Never use an open flame when distilling something flammable... ever!

Alcohol vapors are flammable. A non-electric stove uses an open flame. A still on a stovetop of that kind puts those vapors close to that flame.

There's a reason that moonshine stills have a reputation for blowing up. Open flame heating is that reason.

Use electric heat ONLY , and in moderation, please!

Not only can a still shatter from such an ignition, but the shattering can spread the condensate, which can quickly cause a raging fire if it's strong enough. (IE
burn some or all of a home to the ground).

It's not as much an issue with your little setup there I'm sure, but if anyone gets too impatient or tries to scale this up, it CAN cause them to lose everything,
or even take a life in the worst case.

Esmagamus says: Aug 5, 2008. 2:31 PM REPLY

Still, chemists used open flames in laboratory for years without many problems because they were cautious. Moonshine stills have a bad reputation
mostly because of their poor build quality in prohibition times. Condensers were usually car radiators that had been used with methanol based anti
freeze.

Orchestrapit says: Jun 20, 2008. 10:01 PM REPLY

good advice, and anyone who has played GTA: Vice City will know what you're getting at.

densad says: Jun 8, 2008. 5:18 AM REPLY

Very good advice, but the whole thing should be air-tight for this thing to work, so it won't dangerous if its done right.

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